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okay well thanks again my friend, a lot of people were invited and a lot of people didn't want to know so - I do appreciate it, thanks again
haha just to update the chat a little I asked slabber about http://www.ukpoliceonline.co.uk/ which he recommends, is that right slab?
cheers slab and if you ever get bored - just pop the question to her online! that should liven things up 
Not a problem, her indoors is have a moan that I've been on long enough, she can make me a cuppa to ease my poor fingers!! 
catch you later.
catch you later. well I would like to thank you for spending the last 60 minutes with me chatting over various NT and T.O related issues, it has been a pleasure, thanks indeed for coming along slab
I feel that they would be asked, it wouldn't be thrust upon them if they don't feel confident. It would be a recipe for disaster. The facebook groups seem reasonably quiet. They have good member numbers just not a lot of people posting regular
seems we're singing from the same hymn sheet on that one slab what's happening on the HATO groups on facebook? are they any good? 
slab what's happening on the HATO groups on facebook? are they any good? exactly!! the idea will be you have to wait for a second patrol to turn up, what's the point in that, if it's a double crew, they can crack on with the job in hand.
well you said "the motorway can be unforgiving if you take your eye of the ball." who is going to watch your back if you're single crewed?
I don't think it will work, as it will create "elitism" amongst the lads, granted there are TOs who wouldn't do it, and some who shouldn't!!!
fair comment, isn't this variable crewing going to create a division in T.Os? 
one half will be deemed suitable to go variable crewing, the other half won't! you will have 'trusted' and 'non-trusted' workforce won't you?
one half will be deemed suitable to go variable crewing, the other half won't! you will have 'trusted' and 'non-trusted' workforce won't you?Not providing you stay alert and watch each others backs, the motorway can be unforgiving if you take your eye of the ball.
I spotted that on one of the many forums I frequent, the wife reckons I use the computer too much!!
yeah I saw that zebra crossing clip that you posted from BBC, the interesting thing about that was that 3 Police solos guided that zebra to the central crash barrier and MET POLICE have always steadfastly insisted that the motorway is no place for solos! beautiful clip though, loved it, great commentary too 
yeah shame we don't hear much from Vic now and it looks like somebody has now kicked off a rival bar!! 
what's going on slab?
what's going on slab?It was a dead end job, I only used it to find my feet in civvie street before moving onto better things, are you on about the rowdy bar? I mentioned to Vic Mackay about an area to let off steam where almost anything goes, similar to the NAAFI bar over on the army rumour service website. State 11 was born along with my delightful premises.
I think you are the only member on the site to have an actual forum in your name, how did that happen? 
I worked as a security guard in Croydon's "CUSTODIAN SECURITY" and was proud to get made security sergeant after a few months, loved that job
We shadowed with 3 different forces during our training, granted it was 100's of miles from where we actually work but it gave us a taster as to what they do. I worked as a security guard on a building site when I first left the army. It was lowly paid, but I was single with no outgoings so it was beer tokens.
you said "I would, I've worked 5x14 hour shifts in a week, every week in one of my previous jobs!" are you able to say what the previous job was slab? 
I wouldn't thinks so, as we don't have blues and twos and we're not allowed to speed. Plus if we end up nicking someone the TOV is going to be off road whilst the DP is processed.
I have never heard of T.Os working a shift with BiB - really positive move by your TM, they should really get acknowledgement there
fantastic gotta say - here would there be any benefit in doing it the other way around? a BiB on shadowing duties on a TOV?
Our police do 10 hour shifts, some of the guys have been out 2 or 3 times, I actually enjoyed the duty, it was a refreshing change, as you know, a change is as good as a rest.
so you've all been out at least once, that means that some have been out more than once, isthis for an entire 8 hour shift with BiB?
jolly good idea, never heard of this before, never read of this on NT, how long has this TM been organising this, he should get a medal
I don't know, I've never seen one. We've all been out at least once in my county. We don't get involved with the police work side of things, but we're invaluable at RTC jobs as they can leave us to get on with traffic management whilst they deal with the job in hand.
We go on patrol with the police in their vehicles, fully kitted up with personal radio so we can respond to jobs on either radio network.
We have a pretty good relationship with our local 5-0, it was a little frosty to start with, but as the service has matured and we've shown them what we can do, they've mellowed. Plus our stakeholder TM has worked hard getting shadowing duties organised so when we turn up at jobs it's more first name terms now which is only a good thing
is there a rapport between T.Os and Police where you are? 
They have a download section where various forms etc are loaded to for reference purposes, we already have them as links at the top of the forum whereas over there, they are all located under the same section
possibly but apart from the medal ribbons and shields ..... any other stuff they have that would be good on here?
I don't know if he was the same black rat that used to post on here when I first joined all those many moons ago.
I have a feeling that I met the guy who runs ukpoliceonline on a course in Banstead a few years back (1999) he was the instructor I was a student! since then we have emailed each other a few times and he remembers me well, not only from the course but operationally
They quite like the system, we all have black/yellow chequered medal ribbons to show we are serving HATOs, we also get "Resident HATO" status which allows us more PM space, a private area away from prying eyes and the facility to upload more photos and files etc unlike regular members, the serving police officers also have their own private area.
hmmm what do the other 2 muskerhatos say about these medal ribbons and karma shields? have they commented on them?
They have an awards system that awards medal ribbons, whereas we have stars, they also have karma shields, so the more you post good topics and get involved with the site the more shields you get. I currently have 4 out of the maximum 5!
talking forums facilities hereIt's still ticking along nicely, there are 3 main HATOs on there geeing them up or the 3 Muskerhatos as we call ourselves!! We have a good laugh over there, but we always come "home"
what's happening on ukpoliceonline lately? at one point they had superior smilies to us didn't they? 
Our instructor in basic training referred to it as the slab and it kinda stuck!! I've had a look round the back up site, everything appears to be in order. You also know I also frequent a number of your other forums, I know, I oughta get out more!!
I provided the tie pin company with 4 different angles of all 3 patrol vehicles, the preferred the disco saying it looked the most substantive so they went with that. What is a slabber? as you know, the slang for the motorway is the slab, so as I wander up and down day in day out, I'm the slabber!!
What is a slabber? as you know, the slang for the motorway is the slab, so as I wander up and down day in day out, I'm the slabber!! 
The CSBF were offered them but turned them down. They obviously didn't realise how popular they'd become. I received an email from them saying they don't do tie pins as they got stung on the last one. Their loss over 200 sales and still climbing
only if it's a disco pin, however they've been sold across 5 different forums so they could be from any of them sites;)
ok here slab are there tie pins circulating outstations that could be associated with NT? going rate on ebay £12.50? 
ummmm just an update on a few things talked about earlier on today: I mentioned www.blitzcoder.com the site I went to in 2003 where I first saw forums in action, sadly those forums no longer exist and were taken down a few years back - the other sites mentioned were http://policecommunitysupportofficer.com/ http://www.ufoforums.co.uk/ http://national-ambulance.com/ and http://prisonofficer.org.uk/index.php thanks to Off Network and Haywain for taking part and in a very lively and cheerful AJAX CHAT SESSION today, it was a pleasure for sure
I ruffle enough feathers without NT being laid at my door! As long as the HA is brough into disrepute or anything official is directly copied though, I think they would struggle to make anything stick
well similar to the thing with The Wanderer, TW was on PCSO.com and eventually it transpired that there was no Tos site - NT was born
well there are 3 main sites TBH, NT, prison officer and PCSOs, those are the 3 big ones plus a couple more small forums natn ambo and UFOs
yeah it does for sure so it pretty much a hobby, phpBB.com provide superb support and so does Balckfoot, between them, they make it so I have somebody to run to 24/7
it all started when I found a Blitzcoder forum back in 2003, I loved it and loved the fact that it had zero advertising, ok there is not zero ads on here but pretty close, that's what motivated me after seeing what Blitzcoders did for Blitz users
well I still think single crewing is wrong, almost as bad as not getting double pay on Christmas Day which is taking the piss wholesale but ON would you recommend other TOs carry a leatherman? is it legal to do so?
A plus point is you only have to worry about your own safetyI saw that YOUTUBE clip that you posted on the pigs that got loose on the M11, I was glad to see there was no clue as to any injured pigs - the escaped ones looked in fine feckle
Yes, there are plenty of jobs where an experienced single crew would be quite capable of dealing. BDVs, slip closures etc. It would involve a complete rewrite of procedures.
everyone except you H on single crewing I mean variable crewing HAHA it will need a complete rewrite of the TO manual and the associated risk assessments first right?
on single crewing I mean variable crewing HAHA it will need a complete rewrite of the TO manual and the associated risk assessments first right?The job is pretty much as advertised and as we already have a pretty good Police FORCE I cannot see us being pushed into a role which many of us would not be suited.
what strikes you about the good old days of NT where every second thread involved blue lights, stabbies, batons, arrest powers and all the other stuff we were never going to need in the role that HA had mapped out for us?
part of the station tore off and walloped me across the head as I was taking official action - JEEES it hurt
Lots of these infections going round. Sorry to hear about the injury, how did that happen.
question to you BOTH!!! how did you wind up on NT in the first place? this is going back to 2007
I have had quitea lot to contend with lately, terrible chest infection then I got injured at work
may your motorways be sunny and bright always with all three lanes running free and Off Network is next
ummmm Haywain I would like to thank you for coming onto the AJAX chat section and having a great q/a session!! thank you so much, it's been great
Doubt we'll shrink - but I wonder if long term we could end up working under the MACs. Then eventaully our situation would degrade
yeah that is reasonable in today's climate (as long as it stays around that) amazing to see so many T.Os concerned about redundancies in the poll don't you think?
it is made clear at recruitment BUT IT IS STILL so wrong staff should get double time on Christmas Day, I can't get over that
staff should get double time on Christmas Day, I can't get over thatYes - but that's one thing that is made clear in recruitment. If Shift allowance was increased that would be less of an issue
Umm - can't remember off the cuff. What does need looking at is the shift allowance - very low compared to some
Probationer, Established and Experienced, what are the actual pay figures for those pay bands H?
ooooooo H you git you, NOW YOU'RE TALKING, me and you both, here have you copped Motorway Patrol on Bravo yet?
Vast majority of our customers are very pleased to see us and there's very little follow up, so the bad incidents can be put aside
If you ignore the politics, you can always go home with a warm feeling knowing you've helped someone
yeah a great lump of British workmanship for you, looks the part too, here What do you like about the T.O job?
Its a friendly all round beast - only problem is its not quite as reliable with the pollution control measures. Doesn't like idling
Shogun with the Discovery a close second. The latter would be best if it had a side opening door
that troublemaker? hehe only joking, yes he's a boy alright, got us all our smilies too, who else?
No - life or death rule was brought so that a TM (who are often single crewed) moving from place to place didn't have to drive past an RTC
single crewing is simply putting that single T.O in danger, sooner or later they will look round for a buddy they need THAT ISN'T THERE
Yes to the scene - but not to put in closures. Although sometimes will do simple on slip closures
great if HA have themanpower but they don't! if they want to do it RECRUIT more T.Os!! hundreds waiting to join
Point is Falk, there are some hyper critical trunk roads which should be M Roads but never will be - A12, A14
so if a normal crew attend an accident for example a single crew can be assigned to help? is that right?
Sorry - we have always been allowed to work single crewed in "life or death" situations which you stumble across
why do they want to expand onto trunk roads? for gods sake aren't motorways enough? this is crazy
Bluntly - cost. HA want to expand more onto high priority trunk roads but have no extra funding
It was always in the margins - mainly to prevent embarrassment of TOV on admin runs sailing past a critical incident
With our restrictions on speeding and the scarcity of police if anything starts going wrong can be difficult to get back up
Single crewing needs to be very carefully thought through. There are many who are capable but some who aren't
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RECOMMENDATION
all T.Os across the UK should strongly consider joining a union. Inside staff largely join the PCS union.
Onroad T.Os should really join PROSPECT
If you are already in a union think about encouraging others to consider this issue
read the thread on this
The Public and Commercial Services Union (PCS) is the fifth largest trade union in the UK, with over 300,000 members.
Our members are organised throughout the civil service and government agencies, making us the UK's largest civil service trade union.
Prospect is an independent, thriving and forward-looking trade union with more than 102,000 members in the public and private sectors.
Our members are engineers, scientists, managers and specialists in areas as diverse as agriculture, defence, energy, environment, heritage, shipbuilding and transport. We are the largest union in the UK representing professional engineers.
Prospect advises, defends and supports members if they have a problem at work. We also:- • negotiate pay and conditions
- • campaign for jobs and standards
- • offer valuable benefits and services
- • influence employers and government.
Haywain
slabber
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